- My problem with people who agree with me. P.J. O’Rourke on libertarians. 🙂
- Surely you’ve all heard the story now about the Florida father who came home to find the 18-year-old babysitter diddling his 11-year-old son. But the pictures are priceless and should serve as an object lesson for … the kind of people who badly need object lessons.
- Bovard: “Sweet Land of Growing Indifference.”
- Ha! And I thought I knew a few people who were obsessed with getting reward points on their credit cards. Top this, guys.
- So the ATF is so bad at solving “gun crimes” (or so good at creating them) that it decided it needed to extend its complete lack of competence and integrity into drug crimes, as well???
- “Five Years of Gas-Can Hell.” The fedgov’s motto should be “If it ain’t broke — BREAK IT!” (Via Never Yet Melted)
Hi Claire.
I’m very uneasy about the father beating the babysitter. and even more so at some of the comments that are appearing other places.
Yes, an 18 year old and a 12 year old is at best highly questionable and at worst, downright abusive (and there’s no way that that little runt would ever get a girlfriend his own age). We don’t know what exactly they were doing and what level of willingness or coercion was involved.
I’m deliberately not using the term “consent”. This side of the pond, for mixed gender, the legal fiats for being old enough to give “consent” vary from 13 years old in Spain, approximately half of Europe, including Germany and Italy (combined population 150 million for those two states) the fiat age of consent is 14 years, and at the other end of the scale I can’t remember whether Malta is currently 18 or 21 years.
When I was in my teens, the fiat age of “consent” for two males was 21, there wasn’t an age for females, the apocryphal story has Queen Victoria refusing to believe that such a thing could happen, and insisting that all reference to it was removed from the act of parliament before she would sign it.
If true it was possibly the last use of that royal prerogative.
Of the male peers whom I can think of who were into such things, I can only think of one who was over 21 (he was 32, which probably says something – and yuk! no, I wasn’t anywhere near), none of the others seemed to be have waited for the stupid law.
To round off the idea of “consent”, after “consenting” for the first time, was it anything like what you were expecting? (please, no one give details).
That the father didn’t kill the skinny little runt, suggests that this wasn’t some sort of “blind rage”, or any form of defence of his son, but rather a measured and very severe summary punishment beating.
It was also somewhat brainless
attitudes to male on male sex acts may have changed a lot since I was in my teens, but the nature of teenagers is still the same.
The father’s actions have almost certainly flagged up the identity of his 12 year old son – and knowing teenagers, that boy will now be the butt of endless and merciless teenage p!ss taking (no puns intended).
Why in the world would a 12 year old require any sort of a “babysitter?” Much less a young male for the job… When I was 12, I WAS the babysitter, and never sat for children older than 7. Boys and girls older than that were quite competent to stay at home alone for a time when necessary.
Obviously, there are serious complications these days with leaving children alone at home. The “laws” and busybody neighbors make it dangerous for the parents, and the fact that few children (even into their 20s) are now competent to stay alone is the real problem.
P. J. O’Rourke is a Libertarian?
According to the article I linked and others I’ve read, the kid was 11, not 12, and said the abuse had been going on for three years. If true, nobody is capable of informed consent, certainly not against an older authority figure, at eight.
I don’t know about Florida, but in places I’ve lived, kids under 12 can’t legally be left alone without supervision, thus the babysitter.
I agree that’s an arbitrary age. I agree age-of-consent laws are arbitrary. I certainly know that kids as young as 11 (and much younger) are curious about sex and experiment sexually.
Nevertheless, given the disparity in the two boys’ ages, given that one was in a position of trust and authority over the other, given that even teenagers can understand what’s “legal age” and what’s not, this was pretty clearly abuse. This is not one of those sad cases of an 18-year-old in trouble for having sex with a consenting 17-year old.
How much of the father’s rage had to do with it being homosexual abuse I don’t know and I don’t think it matters much here.
I agree the 11-year-old will probably now take all manner of grief from his peers, though, which is going to be pretty awful for him.
Hi Claire,
Admittedly we don’t know what the father caught them doing, and that may well have a bearing on his initial reaction.
However, he cannot possibly have known at that instant, how long the activities had been going on for.
I do think that the beating is totally disproportionate. Though I’d better add that I am pleased that the cops are staying well away from the beating – if only they’d stick to loitering in donut shops all of the time.
I’m not sure I am understanding some of the comments correctly. So….lemmee get this straight. The beating was disproportionate??? Just where to get that idea? If it was me that kid would have been gelded right on the spot. Not to mention he would no longer be able to speak, see, or hear. It is high time for us as a nation to quit this thing of humane treatment for those who harm others due to some weired sex drive.year Here is something to keep in mind….today’s average 17-20 year old is probably at the same level of maturity as a 12 year old 50 years ago. Why? Well parents today are not the same as they were back then. For the most part they bought the idea it was wrong to physically discipline their kids. Much less boot their ass out the door to get a job cutting grass or shoveling snow after school or weekends. I blame the damm shrinks and teachers that promoted all this namby pamby crap.
Hi Curt,
with all due respect
the little 5h!te was out of the door – supposedly baby sitting
I would also venture to add that parental use of unrestrained physical violence was very much in evidence here.
it is also alleged that the older brat had the younger one physically intimidated into silent complicity – where did he learn that from – if not from having had it applied to him in one way or another, If it was right for older people to physically threaten and beat him into compliance, then what’s to stop him physically threatening and beating his young charge into compliance? Adding yet another wrong does not make that right.
The weird sex drive that you bring up, could well be pertinent. This isn’t something I’ve looked into in any depth, but I do get the impression that there is much more of this sort of crap in the prudish, puritanical societies which indulge in the practice of cutting the most sensitive parts of childrens (particularly boys) genitals off, compared to those which don’t. Perhaps something else to thank the moral busybodying late 19th and early 20th century progressives and post millennialist pietists for?
On a flippant note, back when I was 11 or 12, if one of my little peers had had a 15 – 18 year old female baby sitter who indulged in pants down behaviours – I think we’d all have been on awe of him.
I found out a few months back that one of my little class mates from my early teens, had a father who was a prolific and violent thug of a kiddy fiddler, and ordained minister in the kirk. I hope that my little pal wasn’t one of that Bubba’s little bitches.
Hi Keith,
I see where you are coming from…to a point. Beating a kid is something far different than a spanking or slapping his/her face. I often wonder just how common it really is inside our homes where sexual as well as other physical abuse goes on. My bet is a lot more than we think. The thing is….do we just sit and say “Oh, he has problems” and hope for the best??? I am against the government meddling in a family’s personal business but for the past many years they have done just that. What is the answer? I don’t have a clue, but that doesn’t mean we should not come down with harsh punishment for those that do abuse. Something else, you cannot tell me that the parents of the abuser did not know about his activities. I don’t buy that one bit. HOWEVER, consider the parents of those guys in the Columbine incident……”Oh we didn’t know about all this…we could not invade their privacy. Say What!!!!???
There’s a huge gap between:
sex hormones starting to circulate big time at around 12 to 14 years for boys and as young as nine for some girls; a woman I was together with for a good few years said she’d reached her full height at 12 years. I’d better add that she’d reached “legal” age a good while before I met her (and damn, that was twenty years ago!). With those hormones come urges, curiosity and that overwhelming biological imperative – without which none of us would be here
and
Frontal cortex, not achieving full development until some time in our mid twenties. And with that frontal cortex development, the reasoning powers which separate us from purely instinctual behaviours.
There’s also the confounding factor that the brain circuitry for the primitive urges (primitive in the sense that we share the urges and that particular brain structure with amphibians and reptiles and perhaps even with slugs and snails, perhaps “basic” would be a better word than “primitive” ) of fear, violence and sex all pass through the tiny brain region of the amygdala, and sometimes those circuits can get cross wired, with predictable results.
Somehow in human evolutionary history, there has been a selection process which favoured the survival of the offspring of those who had greater reasoning ability
That implies that at least one of the parents was old enough for full, or near full brain development to have taken place.
Between the advent of agriculture and the industrial revolution, puberty and brain maturity may have occurred closer together than they do now (due to poorer diet and more disease and parasite burden). I still don’t think that the two coincided exactly
so somehow there was a means of at least preventing males with immature brains from impregnating females – or at least if they did, there was sufficeint mortality that some sort of eugenic process operated – favouring the evolution of intelligence.
Without that selection process, we’d have frontal lobes comparable to the other branches of our evolutionary family tree; Chimps, Bonobos and Gorillas, and literary abilities to match (incidentally, we’re well past the period of peak diversity amongst apes. Ape species have been in decline for a few million years, even allowing for as yet undiscovered crypto species (genetically Bonobos, Chimps and humans are approximately equi distant – until only a few years ago chimps and bonobos were considered to be a single species) only a few remnants are left)
There is no reason to believe that the process of preventing immature males from impregnating females was necessarily a pleasant or peaceful process.
It may be that some of those males took their frustrations out on each other.
Now add in some unpleasant cultural aspects.
Some parts of Europe got more than their fair share of puritanical protestantism – and some of the most extreme elements, left for a place where they could practice and inflict religious discrimination to their miserable little hearts’ content: New England.
One of their key beliefs was that it was up to the elect to create their miserable god’s kingdom on earth by eradicating sin for 1,000 years, then Jesus would return and call the day of judgement to reward them – and oh boy could they find sin! Jesus turned water into wine – those buggers prohibited wine.
Now add to that straight laced puritainism, some crank psychiatric and evolutionary theories:
1) that the sexual activities seen ammongst adolescents suffering from dementia precox were a cause rather than an effect
2) that a genetic degeneracy was possible (and illustrated by those sufferers from dementia precox)
Now add in some crank medics looking for a job
3) that those “problems” could be solved surgically – in the same way that the most brutal and puritanical middle eastern and African tribes surgically controlled their members sexual behaviour
I think you’ve got a pretty unpleasant mix.
I haven’t looked closely into this, I’m aware that there is a literature, but I’m not fully familiar with it – on the sexual and behavioural dysfunction of mutilated males.
????? Ok….let me put it this way. When I was a kid in high school you were treated as a responsible young adult. What I am getting at is as a child displays more responsibility they get more privilges. What I am seeing today in a lot of highschool kids as well as those out of high school is no sense of responsibility. A friend of mine owns a restaurant, he hires this young person who is told to report to work later that afternoon…person does not show up and doesn’t even have the sense to call the owner. Granted, some kids today are really outstanding but most….sorry, I wouldn’t hire them. In short, it is my belief that parents and even more so the school systems have droped the ball big time. So….in that light the kid that was the abuser, even if he was a victim of his father’s rage was still old enough to know right from wrong. I have no sympathy for such kind at all.
Thanks,just went to Am#zon and ordered 2 Scepter Water Can (5-Gallon).19.95
Pick up some red Krylon Fusion plastic spray paint at Ace for 5.99,Im in business with ‘water’ cans that work.
Poke a hole in the top of that gas can, carve a plug our of soft wood for it.
Or just google “NATO jerry can price”, and buy a proper NATO gas can and spout.
If you want a working plastic can, you can get one from a motorcycle dealer that specializes in dirt bikes.
You can also get “Eagle” brand gas cans, big metal ones sold to refuel landscaping equipment.
Just stay out of the walmart automotive aisle.
Thanks for the plug / link, Claire!
But looking at the other comments on this thread – am I obliged to write at least 1500 words?
Concerning the gas cans, fortunately I have older plastic cans. Unfortunately, the spouts wore down, cracked, etc; leaking gas is no fun. Fortunately, as a poster mentioned on the other article, there is a replacement kit available via the web, or in my case at Fleet Farm (disclaimer – the ez pour nozzle did not fit my oldest plastic gas can): http://ezpourspout.com/wp/
Of course, I would never encourage someone with the newer style can to drill a hole, and use the replacement plug that comes with the kit.
That Dad did a favor for that kid. Maybe now with the beating, there will be a little more deterrence to this behavior, and he won’t end up as a 40-year old seducing toddlers. But as far as I’m concerned, the Dad showed too much restraint.
On the other hand, if the offender were female, I would have little problem with it. Sorry if you find that inconsistent. Men and women are not the same…
Has it really been only *5* years of gas can hell?
And I pick up old style (antique ) gas cans at auctions when I go.